Letters June 2005
From: Mrs Betts
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Thank
you for sending the GIHS Newsletter, etc. to my husband. Jim enjoyed
belonging to the Society and would have renewed his membership, but sadly he
died in January.
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From: Trisha Jaffe
50 years ago, Kidbrooke was opened as
the first purpose-built comprehensive in the country. This year, we are
celebrating all that comprehensive schooling has achieved in the intervening
years. We are also very aware that the challenges to the principle and practice
of comprehensive education get greater by the year. We are inviting you to join
us in celebrating all that has been gained in education at a conference that
the school has arranged. At this we will also be looking at the future of the
comprehensive ideal. How do we build on the best of what has been, in order
that we have schools for the 21st century that include everyone? We do hope
that you will feel that this is a conference that you can both enjoy and one
that can challenge thinking about the future.
While you are at the conference,
you will be able to enjoy a lunch, selected from the menu that has been
developed by Jamie Oliver as part of his,
Jamie's School Dinners programme. Along with our kitchen staff, he has
transformed eating in this school, and hopefully, beyond in the LEA. I do hope
that you will join us for the day on 1st July, 2005.
From: Brian Middlemiss
The Siemens Brothers Engineering Society has collected,
catalogued and formally re-housed almost 1500 items donated by members and
friends in an endeavour to record for posterity something about the existence
of the Company in Woolwich - its history, products, pioneering design and
manufacture in electrical equipment and telecommunications world wide.
Importantly too, we have many items and photographs depicting the varied work
and social activities engaged in, by a site employing around 7000 or so people.
We are particularly anxious to bring our archive material to the notice of
members of Societies, Associations and Education Departments such as yours,
which nurture a continuing interest in specific aspects of times past. Much of
the enthusiasm and impetus shown, by our now ageing members, for the archive
project stems from thoughts that 37 years have elapsed since the works closed
and thus we are among the last engineers really able to leave a knowledgeable
record of how world telecommunications grew and functioned before our present
day electronic environment arrived! On behalf of the Engineering Society I
would therefore welcome any help which you could give by generally 'spreading
the word' regarding the various locations of our Archive Catalogue and
Material.
John Ford, from the Siemens Brothers
Engineering Society is booked to speak to GIHS on 11th October
From: Rich Sylvester
I would like to tell you about the new Memories and Stories of East Greenwich project. The group will research
and record local memories and the industrial heritage of the Greenwich
Peninsula (the former South Met Gasworks - generally
known as the Dome site). Stories and local history records take us back to the
1800's of Greenwich Marsh.
On the same site
200 years on we are in the early phases of a major housing development around
the "Dome" - and the landscape has been extensively remodeled with
groundwork and remediation of the "brownfields" left by the industry
of the interviewing period. By the river we can still identify the wharves and
sites of industrial buildings that once thrived with local business such as
whaling and rope making. The pubs and street names give us further clues, while
on the pockets of foreshore still accessible to the public we can find old
nails and fragments of clay pipe which are all part of the jigsaw that we will
piece together to tell or remind us all of the amazing history of this area.
The children from Millennium and Meridian Primary schools will
investigate the changing riverscape through inter-generational interviews and
web-based dialogue focusing on the changes to industry and local life from 1930
to the present day. Through a series of workshops with an oral history tutor,
they will record the memories of local residents, who remember the river and
its historical role. The over 50's Club will attend training sessions in IT and
historical data recording, assisting with web-based research; scanning images
and documents from the local heritage centre. One result will be the production
of 2000 heritage trail maps providing a snapshot of a rapidly disappearing
cultural heritage. The project will provide a channel for local people (new
residents and present) to express and explore what they know and value about
the Peninsula. To this end we are pleased to hear from anyone who lives or
works on or around the Peninsula as well as those who have lived or worked
there in the past.
Richard Sylvester (Co-ordinator)
From: Felicity Harrison
I have been lent a postcard, posted in 1906, which is captioned Molassine Co's Dinner, Sturminster Newton 1906 to use a part
of a series in our local magazine. I live in Sturminster and was intrigued to
see this card. Having read various articles and clips about the company in your
newsletters on the Web I feel that the connection must be cattle feed as, until
recently, the town hosted the biggest calf market in the country and dairying
was the major industry. But... according to the information the company wasn't
formed until 1907 and why were they in Sturminster? Please can you shed any
light on this or point me towards the right direction to further my research?
From: Anne Benney
Volunteers from the Blackheath Society clear and tidy the Station
"garden" twice a year. We did it the other last Sunday and some
thought "station garden" was misleading. "Wildlife garden"
has been tried but doesn't quite suit either. Although there are bound to be
ideas from within the Blackheath Society, I wondered if a member of the
Greenwich Industrial History Soc. might have a suggestion. If you can help to
give this stretch of disused rails its proper name I'd be glad to hear from you
- maybe it should be called whatever was its original name (the sidings or
shunting yard perhaps) - we'd like to get it right or at least arrive at a
consensus.
From: Pamela White
I came across the article posted on the Internet entitled Greenwich
Millennium Site, 200 Years of Innovation. The section that was of interest to
me gave mention of the East Greenwich Gas Works. My
great-grandfather, George Cutler, was an engineer and
worked in the Samuel Cutler and Sons firm that built the two gasholders. I
would be most interested to receive any information that you may have on the
firm, Samuel Cutler, and on gas works in general. Am I correct to assume from
the material on the Web, that one can still see the remnants of the gas holder,
located on Tunnel Ave and visible from the A102(M), Blackwell Tunnel Approach?
If one wished to view the gas holder, what would be the best location? I also
understand that the firm owned by Samuel Cutler was located on the Isle of
Dogs. Has anyone ever done an industrial history of the firm? It would appear
from what I have read that the labour history as well as the engineering
background of the era and the project are most fascinating.
This query has been referred to a number of gas industry historians who
hopefully will report further. However, Brian Sturt says "I am not certain
if the holders at East Greenwich were built by Samuel Cutler and Company. I am
almost certain that the second holder was built by Clayton's". Attached is
an article on Cutlers from the Gas Journal, Volume 212, October 2nd 1935, pages
37-39.
This article – more detail in a future
issue – says that George and Samuel Cutler set up a factory for the manufacture
of gas works plant in 1844 in the City Road, Islington. In 1858 the business
had expanded and the firm moved to Providence Ironworks Millwall. The firm was
particularly identified with gasholder construction – they were the largest
moving metal structures in the world and Cutlers were identified with the
largest. They operate 24 hours a day year-in year-out in all weathers almost
unattended. (The article says some have run for half a century in this way –
the East Greenwich Holder has now operated for 120 years – and others still
longer).
Malcolm Tucker also confirms that the
East Greenwich holder was not built by Cutlers but by Claytons.
From: Gill Selley, Woodbury Local
History Society
I am researching Montague Wigzell, born in the City of
London in 1831, the son of Eustace Wigzell. He was an artist and inventor. He
came to Exeter in 1854 as the first headmaster of the Exeter School of Art and
in 1866 became the first headmaster of the Croydon School of Art.
In 1861 he
formed the Patent Spiral Fluted Nail Company and
manufactured this in Topsham, near Exeter. In 1866 he was declared bankrupt. In
his bankruptcy examination it was stated that he had seven 'ventilators',
another of his inventions, at the Greenwich works. From 1859 he had invented a
gun battery, various types of nails, a double ventilator and a candle-making
machine. There is evidence that he was making candles and ventilators as well
as his spiral fluted nails at Topsham, but he must have had a family connection
or perhaps a manufactory in Greenwich. He had a brother called Atwood who
described himself as a 'practical engineer', and there was a Eustace Wigzell
who was thought to be a marine engineer from Greenwich, possibly his father or
brother. I would be very grateful if you have any information about Montague
Wigzell in the Greenwich area. I have found that Wigzells were living in the
area in the Victorian period. In 1855 a Eustace Wigzell Esq. was living in
Blackheath Road and in the 1881 census a Eustace Wigzell, aged 31, described as
a mechanical engineer (possibly son of the former), was living in Deptford.
From: Jeff Nicholas
I wonder whether you or some of the members of your Historical Society
might be able to help me. I have the task of writing a small biography of Edward G Barnard M.P. for Greenwich between 1832 and 1847. He
was from the famous Barnard shipbuilding
dynasty. My task is to find out more about E.G. as there is a major street
named after him here in Adelaide, South Australia. He had something to do with
the South Australian Commission which was set
up under act of parliament in 1834 to see through the settlement of a new
colony in South Australia. Is there a painting or image of him somewhere? We
know that he owned Gosfield Hall and spent a lot of
money on it. Is there anyone in your society who might be interested in
following him up for me?
From: Toby Butler
Thank you for your interest in Memoryscape. I am very keen to evaluate my research, so I'll be organising some
walks that anyone can come to (I'll provide a CD-Walkman) and I'll give out a
short questionnaire afterwards; I would also like to organise a small group
discussion after the walk. If anyone wants to come on an organised walk, just
tell them to get in touch. Also, if you know of a group or organisation who
would like to come on a walk, please let me know and I could do one specially.
It would take about two hours - I am particularly keen for people to listen to
the walks actually walking, not at home or in a meeting room.
Of course, the walks can also be done on your own and I will happily
send a free copy to anyone who is willing to actually do the walk and fill in a
questionnaire for me! They just have to give me a call or e-mail and I'll send
one off to them. If you need any more info, please don't hesitate to get in
touch.
Toby is arranging a walk for GIHS
members on 24th July.
From: Bob Carr
Do you know David Lloyd. Who is he? He is very interested in the
Greenwich Steam Ferry.
The Greenwich and Rotherhithe Steam Ferries share David
Lloyd’s web page with two railway sites from the West Country – so, no, we
don’t know who David Lloyd is. David......... are you there?
The Greenwich Steam Ferry was the one
that ran from Wood Wharf, Horseferry Road to the Isle of Dogs – Clive Chambers
described some of the archaeology of the site in a recent talk to GIHS. David’s
site describes the two original boats, Countess of Lathom and Countess of
Zetland as well as the cylinders sunk in the riverside wall and the steam
engines themselves. There is a lot of interest in the site – but nothing at all
about the recent demolitions there.
The Webmeister reports in 2017.. David
Lloyd's site is unfortunately no longer functional, but Forgotten
Highway's site may be of interest regarding this
particular ferry crossing.
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